The Scoop On MashBoxX

Wayne Rosso has been a longtime critic of the RIAA. He has blasted them for suing file sharers who allegedly trade copyrighted music files on P2P networks and for conducting a smear campaign against P2P networks and developers. I say allegedly because, thus far, each person who has been subpoenaed by the RIAA has settled out of court because they can not afford to hire an attorney. Rosso was also a proponent of a collective compulsory license scheme, which would consist of a monthly or yearly fee charged to those who wanted to trade copyrighted music.

Recently, he announced that he would be founding a new pay service called MashBoxX and he’s promoting it as a P2P network, but in reality it’s just another industry approved pay service with a twist. MashBoxX will reportedly incorporate Snocap, which is software that fingerprints and identifies copyrighted music files traded on a network. Utilizing this system, copyright owners will have the ability to control how these music files are traded and set a price that will be paid each time these files are downloaded. MashBoxX itself hasn’t been directly approved by the industry, however, Universal Music is working together with Snocap to distribute their music online so MashBoxX will be following the rules set forth by Universal Music and any other record label who may partner with Snocap in the future.

Ironically, the man who claimed to have P2P’s best interests at heart might be the one who will help the RIAA exterminate most of the current P2P networks. Sharman Networks (owners of Kazaa) are currently being sued by the recording industry in Australia. They are being accused of having the ability to filter out copyrighted music files. The recording industry attorney’s have claimed that since Sharman Networks have indicated that they can filter child porn, they can filter any content if they wish to do so. Sharman Network representatives have backed off those claims and are now stating that although they would like to filter out child porn from their network, they have no way of preventing users from trading any types of files.

If Snocap can effectively prevent file sharers from trading copyrighted music files on MashBoxx, the RIAA may be able to convince the Supreme Court to force all P2P networks to either incorporate the Snocap filtering software, or close down. Adam Eisgrau, the head of P2P United, seems to already realize that the RIAA will use this against P2P networks in the future and has stated that he will fight any attempt made to filter content on the networks P2P United represents. "We will not do this voluntarily," Eisgrau said. He went on to say, "What's being suggested is that every file transfer must first pass through their database. From a privacy perspective, from a free speech perspective, from a network effectiveness perspective, that's preposterous. I understand why it makes sense to Hollywood and friends. I don't understand why it would make sense to anybody else."

Wayne Rosso agreed to address these issues.

1) It has been reported that you have said music files will cost roughly $1 each. This is the same amount being charged on iTunes and several other industry approved pay services. You have stated that Mashboxx will offer free previews and possibly free radio quality radio music files. But iTunes already allows people to preview songs for free. Why should people pay $1 for a music file when they can get it on iTunes without using their bandwidth to upload songs to other people?

Wayne Rosso: To begin with, I'm not really sure that songs will be $1 each. Maybe less. And MashBoxX will offer the whole track to preview, not just those stupid 30-second clips. And it's important to remember that MashBoxX is NOT a download store, and therefore should not be compared to iTunes. If you still want to make that analog
y, just remember that the day we launch we'll have at least 10 times the titles that iTunes offers. And besides, MashBoxX IS a P2P application and users will have full and complete access to all content. Nothing is being "filtered" or blocked. The real idea is that unauthorized copies of Snocap registered content will become authorized and the user will have the option to purchase the track. The file sharing experience will remain basically intact. Furthermore, MashBoxX will offer more than the typical P2P program. It is a multifaceted total entertainment experience that melds the web with P2P.


2) If Snocap can effectively prevent users from trading copyrighted music files on the Mashboxx network, the RIAA will begin to sue P2P networks once again and this time they will have a new attack
strategy. They will claim that since Mashboxx can filter out copyrighted material, Snocap will work on any network and they can claim that if P2P developers refuse to implement this filtering software, they are aiding and inducing copyright infringement. If/when
this happens will you accept any responsibility about your role in assisting the RIAA's fight against P2P?

Wayne Rosso: Absolutely not! If you haven't noticed, this claim is one of the major pillars of their Supreme Court brief. And this is not a new argument. Let's get one thing straight right now: I will never kiss the RIAA's ass. They're animals as far as I'm concerned. But I do honestly believe that the P2P business as it exists now is in real trouble. The current business model is doomed in my opinion. Therefore every company has to look for new ways to reinvent itself. This is a normal part of any business cycle, but is amplified in the case of P2P due to the legal and legislative environment, which, if you haven’t noticed, isn’t so great. I have been very consistent in my views. I have always maintained that content owners should be paid for their content. I have been very vocal about wanting to work with record companies in order to find a solution. I've been begging for years for licenses from them. I was approached by the CEO of one of the major record labels to do just that. So I felt morally obligated to step up and work with him. In my opinion, I won the war. I was presented with the opportunity to get what I've been working towards for years. I would be a hypocrite if I didn't step up. And now I'm being called a hypocrite for not being a hypocrite! And by the way, I don't hear anybody accusing iMesh of aiding and abetting the RIAA.


3) You have said that people will be attracted to Mashboxx because it will let them share songs without having to worry about lawsuits from the RIAA or the MPAA, or about "spyware" programs that are sometimes packaged with files downloaded from free services. Don’t you think that’s disingenuous? The best way to prevent being infected with spyware is to use a program like AdAware or Spybot, not by using a pay service and the reason why people won’t be sued by the RIAA on your
network is because they will be PAYING them each time they purchase their songs. It seems that you are resorting to the same propaganda that the industry approved pay services use since they have made the
exact same claims when promoting their own pay services.

Wayne Rosso: Horseshit. I'm out to build a viable business and the current P2P business model, in my opinion, has nowhere to go. It's a dead end street. I happen to believe that somehow, someway, Hollywood will find a way to fuck with P2P's to the point where they will never be the same. You can take that to the bank. I'm not in the business to promote Hollywood's agenda. I'm in the business to promote MY agenda. And that agenda is to build a viable business and at the same time provide a perfectly legal and legitimate service for customers. It's in my nature to be an outlaw of sorts. That will never change. But one has to think of the future. The other services are not p2p's and we're not a download store. I haven't based
our success on whether or not people
buy $1 singles. Besides, who would you rather be in business with,
Gator or Sony? Not that you have to choose, but that's pretty much a no-brainer in my book.

And believe me, I've been called a lot of things, a lot of them
accurate. But disingenuous is not one of them. The only way you get in
trouble with the press is when you tell the truth. And I'm always in
trouble as a result. I'm known for my complete candor, if anything. If
people can't handle it, there's nothing I can do about it. I'm old
enough to have learned that in life half the people you meet are going
to hate you and half are going to like you. And there's nothing you can
do to change the minds of the 50% who hate you. So you might as well
concentrate on the other 50%.


4) On June 18, 2004 I wrote a story about how the DCIA was trying to cozy up to the RIAA by trying to entice them to join forces (Specifically with Sharman Networks) to sell their music instead of fighting against them and that their struggle was primarily for money, not for fair use. Marty Lafferty objected to a lot of points made in the story and you replied by saying, “Well, looks like the DCIA won't be offering to buy their way into Slyck's good graces like they buy their way into "sponsoring" industry events and conferences. Seems like that's the only way they can promote their agenda as the press seems to have caught onto them.� It now seems that your agenda has been exposed. You were once an advocate for a collective compulsory license scheme, but your pay service will charge users roughly $1 for each music file and your collaboration with Snocap will provide the RIAA with additional ammunition in their fight to eliminate true P2P networks.

Wayne Rosso: OK. Let's start with the collective licensing issue. Make no mistake. I am totally in favour of collective licensing. That's the best solution. But in the real world I don't think that's going to happen, at least not in my lifetime. But I will continue to fight for it. Now how do you think that will be received? An authorized retailer of content promoting collective licensing? So who will that help the most, the RIAA or P2P's? As far as my agenda goes, I think that I've pretty much laid it all out. I have no hidden agenda. I just honestly feel that this whole war has to come to and end somehow. I want to try to change things for the better, as does my record company CEO friend. He's an honest, sincere man. And I believe his motives are as well. I also want to be successful, and I make no apologies for that. I also don't expect MashBoxX to be accepted by Slyck.com or it's readers. I like and support Slyck, and I understand and respect its opinions and that's fine with me. I don't mind being criticized, I'm a big boy and can take the heat. We're not looking for MashBoxX to appeal to the hard-core file sharers anyway. That will never happen and we know it. We're looking for the casual users. The Kazaa users are our target audience, if you get my drift.

Now, to compare me with Marty Lafferty, that's another story. You
really know how to hurt a guy. I may not be much in the looks, brains
and personality department, but I'm no Marty Lafferty. He couldn't
carry my dirty laundry. I've never seen the guy give a straight answer
to a question. So I guess he really is perfectly at home in Washington
DC. Unlike Marty and his goofy DCIA, I never sucked up to the RIAA. The
record industry approached me. I will never be an RIAA toady. But I can
separate the organization from its members. And quite frankly, the
majority of the record label people who I've been dealing with have
been very nice to me and treated me with respect. Don't forget that I
was in the record business for 30 years and know how to talk to these
guys. But Mitch Bainwol doesn't like me too much.


5) Through Snowcap, copyright owners can set clear rights. Does this include a form o
f DRM which will determine how many times a file can be burned or copied?

Unfortunately the answer is yes. I'm not a big fan of DRM. We all know
that it's stupid and useless. But it's a fact of life that I just have
to deal with. I fight it every chance I get. And at least I'm in the
room with these guys on a regular basis and am trying to show them the
light. But it's an uphill battle. Besides, the recording industry has a
much bigger problem with the issue of file formats. They're pretty much
blind to that right now and I don't think that many realize how that's
going to come back and bite them in the ass. But that's not my problem.
I think that you're going to be seeing more a more loosening of DRM
restrictions, however. I've left one fight and am now engaged in another with DRM. Welcome, my friends, to the show that never ends.


6) The RIAA has strung the DCIA along and, in the meantime, they have been trying to come up with new ways to shutdown the networks they represent. Do you feel as if they're using Snocap to prove that P2P
networks can filter content? If so, why are you getting involved with Snocap when you know that this affiliation will harm P2P?

Wayne Rosso: I'm not really sure that Snocap will harm P2P. I think that there's a lot of misconceptions and misinformation floating around about Snocap. And let's be clear: MashBoxX is not using Snocap to filter anything. We do not block content. Snocap is providing a means for me to get the record industry out of my ass so that we can build a more all-encompassing product than what's floating around in the P2P world right now. MashBoxX will not be a Kazaa clone, quite the opposite. Here again, I don't hear the name iMesh being mentioned.

And the DCIA was born to be strung along. I don't take shit from
anybody, especially the RIAA. I am in constant contact with P2P United
and am a supporter. I have undoubtedly been the most vocal supporter of
P2P and I am completely consistent with my views. I firmly believe in
fair use and admire Rep. Rick Boucher's efforts on its behalf. I do
believe that copyright laws need to be drastically overhauled. I
support the EFF and I have no problem reconciling those beliefs. I'm
not trying to prove anything. I'm just trying to be successful and
provide a quality product. If anybody has any problem with that, too
fucking bad.


I’d like to thank Wayne Rosso for taking the time to answer these questions and for the record, iMesh was never brought up because they lost all their credibility months ago.